For those of you who are anxious to see what Roger Clemens had to say during his interview with Mike Wallace on 60 Minutes, look no further. However if you want to watch the interview and do not want to know what happens, stop reading. If not, please continue on.
[Editors note: This post was published before the interview aired]
Here is the full transcript of the interview courtesy of CBS via the Boston Globe. And here is a link to the video.
STUDIO OPEN: WITH 354 WINS, ROGER CLEMENS IS ONE OF THE BEST PITCHERS IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL. NO QUESTION ABOUT IT. BUT THERE ARE QUESTIONS NOW ABOUT WHETHER ROGER CLEMENS CHEATED TO ENHANCE HIS RECORD AND PROLONG HIS CAREER. ONE OF HIS FORMER TRAINERS, BRIAN MCNAMEE SAYS THAT HE HIMSELF INJECTED CLEMENS WITH STEROIDS AND HUMAN GROWTH HORMONE. MCNAMEE’S ACCUSATIONS WERE THE BIGGEST REVELATIONS IN GEORGE MITCHELL’S REPORT ON STEROID ABUSE FOR MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL. BUT CLEMENS INSISTS THE CHARGES ARE PHONY–THAT HE NEVER USED STEROIDS OR ANY OTHER BANNED SUBSTANCE. CLEMENS AGREED TO ANSWER OUR QUESTIONS AT HIS HOME OUTSIDE HOUSTON WHERE WE FOUND HIM TO BE FRUSTRATED, EVEN FURIOUS, THAT SO MANY PEOPLE HAVE BEEN SO QUICK TO BELIEVE HE CHEATED.
CLEMENS: I’m angry that that what I’ve done for the game of baseball and the personal, in my private life, what I’ve done that I I don’t get the benefit of the doubt The stuff that’s being said, it’s ridiculous. It’s hogwash for people to even assume this. 24, 25 years Mike. You’d think I’d get an inch of respect. An inch. How, how can you prove your innocence?
WALLACE Apparently you haven’t done it yet. People I talk to say, “Come on. 45 years old? How does he still throw a ball and compete and so forth? Impossible.”
CLEMENS Not impossible. You do it with hard work. Ask any of my teammates. Ask anybody that’s come here and and done the work with me.
WALLACE I was down here in 2001. You were pitching to a guy by the name of…
CLEMENS Brian McNamee, that’s right.
TRACK: MCNAMEE HELPED CLEMENS WORK OUT–ON AND OFF–FOR TEN YEARS. CLEMENS IS FAMOUS FOR HIS EXHAUSTING WORKOUTS. HE’S BEEN CALLED THE HARDEST WORKING MAN IN THROW-BUSINESS. BUT NOW HE’S BEEN THROWN BY WHAT MCNAMEE TOLD GEORGE MITCHELL.
WALLACE He gave very specific examples of times he says that he injected you with steroids. During the ’98 season, you were pitching for the Blue Jays. McNamee was their strength and conditioning coach. From the Mitchell Report, quote: “Clemens approached McNamee, and for the first time, brought up the subject of using steroids. Clemens said that he was not able to inject himself and he asked for McNamee’s help. McNamee injected Clemens approximately four times in the buttocks over a several week period, with needles that Clemens provided. Each incident took place in Clemens apartment.
CLEMENS Never happened. Never happened. And if if if I have these needles and these steroids and all these drugs, what, where did I get ‘em. Where is the person out there gave ‘em to me? Please, please come forward.
WALLACE Mitchell Report, quote: “According to McNamee, from the time McNamee injected Clemens with Winstrol, a steroid, through the end of the ’98 season, Clemens performance showed remarkable improvement. Clemens told McNamee that the steroids, quote, had a pretty good effect on him. McNamee said Clemens was also training harder and dieting better during this time.”
CLEMENS Never. I trained hard my entire career. It just didn’t happen.
WALLACE Why would Brian McNamee want to betray you?
CLEMENS I don’t know. I’m so upset about it, how I treated this man and took care of him.
WALLACE I imagine he’s watching the two of us right now, wouldn’t you?
CLEMENS I hope he is.
WALLACE Okay. Anything you want to tell him.
CLEMENS Yeah. I treated him fairly. I treated him as great as anybody else. I helped him out!
WALLACE Again, from the Mitchell Report, quote, “According to McNamee, during the middle of the 2000 season, Clemens made it clear he was ready to use steroids again. And during the latter part of the season, McNamee injected Clemens in the buttocks four to six times with testosterone. Also injected Clemens four to six times with Human growth hormone.
CLEMENS My body never changed. If he’s putting that stuff up in my body, if what he’s saying which is totally false, if he’s doing that to me, I should have a third ear coming out of my forehead. I should be pulling tractors with my teeth.
WALLACE The next season 2001. It’s from the Mitchell Report, quote, “According to McNamee, Clemens advised him in August of 2001 that he was again ready to use steroids. And shortly thereafter, McNamee injected Clemens with a steroid on four to five occasions at Clemens’ apartment-
CLEMENS Yeah. Never happened.
WALLACE In two of the three years that McNamee claims that he injected you—’98 and 2001 you won 20 games and the Cy Young award as the American League’s best pitcher.
CLEMENS I won—in 1997 I won the Cy Young Award. 2004 when he supposedly, I wasn’t doing it.
WALLACE Yeah, but these are the years in which McNamee claims that he injected you.
CLEMENS It didn’t happen. It didn’t happen. It just didn’t happen.
TRACK: SO WHILE CLEMENS WAS HIS LEAGUE’S BEST PITCHER DURING TWO OF THE ALLEGED STEROID YEARS, HE WAS ALSO HIS LEAGUE’S BEST THE YEAR BEFORE MCNAMEE SAYS INJECTIONS BEGAN; AND THREE YEARS AFTER MCNAMEE SAYS HE STOPPED GIVING CLEMENS STEROIDS.
CLEMENS Why didn’t I keep doing it if it was so good for me? Why didn’t I break down? Why didn’t my tendons turn to dust? That’s all it’s good for. It’s a quick fix. I don’t believe in that. I don’t do it.
WALLACE What was your first reaction when you heard what McNamee had said?
CLEMENS I I was shocked. I was angry. A lot of emotions.
WALLACE You’re still shocked. You’re still angry.
CLEMENS Oh definitely.
WALLACE Did you know ahead of time what was going be in George Mitchell’s report?
CLEMENS I did not.
WALLACE Did Brian McNamee tell you what he was going to say to—
CLEMENS Didn’t tell me a word.
TRACK: BUT HE DID ASK CLEMENS FOR A FAVOR JUST A FEW DAYS BEFORE THE MITCHELL REPORT CAME OUT.
CLEMENS He emails me and asks me where all the good fishing equipment is down at Cabo that I bought so he can go fishing. Thank you very much. I said, Have a good time, go fishing. Doesn’t say a word that you, that you know I’m fixing to bury you with all these accusations and what do we do about it. Didn’t say a word about it. That’s what pisses me off.
WALLACE Why didn’t you speak to George Mitchell’s investigators?
CLEMENS I listened to my counsel. I was advised not to. A lot of the
players didn’t go down and talk to him.
WALLACE I know.
CLEMENS But if I would’ve known what this man, Brian McNamee had said in this report, I would have been down there in a heartbeat to take care of it.
WALLACE George Mitchell says he believes McNamee and this is why. McNamee got caught up in a federal steroids investigation, and the federal prosecutors agreed not to charge him if he told the truth about his involvement with steroids. But they would charge him if he gave any false information. So Mitchell says McNamee had strong incentives to tell the truth.
WALLACE What, hold, what did McNamee gain by lying?
CLEMENS Evidently not going to jail.
WALLACE Jail time for what?
CLEMENS Well, I think he’s been buying and movin’ steroids.
TRACK: CLEMENS SAYS HE LEARNED THAT FROM THE MITCHELL REPORT, WHICH ALSO MENTIONED HIS FELLOW YANKEE PITCHER ANDY PETTITE, WHO ALSO TRAINED UNDER MCNAMEE. MCNAMEE SAID HE’D INJECTED PETTITE TWICE WITH HUMAN GROWTH HORMONE. AFTER THE REPORT CAME OUT, PETTITE CONFIRMED THAT MCNAMEE HAD GIVEN HIM TWO H.G.H..SHOTS TO RECOVER FROM AN ELBOW INJURY.
WALLACE When Andy confirmed that McNamee had indeed told the truth about injecting him, that gave McNamee credibility, made his claims about injecting you seem more believable.
CLEMENS I have I had no knowledge of what Andy was doing.
WALLACE Why would Brian McNamee tell the truth about Andy Pettitte and lie about you?
CLEMENS Andy’s case is totally is, is totally separate. I was shocked to learn about Andy’s situation. Had no idea about it.
TRACK: AND WE HAD NO IDEA HOW MANY LEGAL INJECTIONS CLEMENS HAS RECEIVED—INCLUDING FROM MCNAMEE .
WALLACE Did your former trainer, Brian McNamee ever inject you with anything?
CLEMENS Yes he did.
WALLACE What?
CLEMENS Lidocaine, and B12. It’s for my joints and and B12 I take still today. A lot of trainers—
WALLACE And that’s all.?
CLEMENS That’s it.
WALLACE Never, never a human growth hormone?
CLEMENS Never.
WALLACE Never testosterone?
CLEMENS Never. Never.
WALLACE And never anabolic steroids?
CLEMENS Never.
WALLACE Swear?
CLEMENS Swear.
TRACK: MCNAMEE’S ATTORNEY COUNTERED THAT MCNAMEE ONLY INJECTED CLEMENS WITH STEROIDS AND HUMAN GROWTH HORMONE– NOTHING ELSE. BEYOND MCNAMEE, CLEMENS TOLD US HE GOT LEGAL INJECTIONS FROM TEAM TRAINERS, MOSTLY PAIN KILLERS.
CLEMENS The number of shots that you get over the course of a season which was many for me. Whether they be vitamins or, for pain, Thorodol. Pain shots. To go out and perform. I had one of my biggest arguments with Joe Torre. He’s wanting to scratch me on the big—one of the biggest starts of the season. Had a small tear in my hamstring and a golf ball in my elbow.
WALLACE Uh-huh
CLEMENS Joe Torre and I were in the the trainers room and he basically shut the door and said, I don’t need any damn heroes here. You didn’t tell me how bad you’re hurtin. I notice you’re hurtin’. And I told Joe Torre that I’ll be damned if 15 minutes before I’m gonna start a World Series game I’m gonna go out there and look my teammates in the eye and tell ‘em I can’t go. I said, as long as the other team doesn’t know that I’m hurting, I can get people out throwin’ 85 without using my leg. And get you six innings under my belt. I’m gonna take this Torodol shot and hope it works. And mask some of this pain so I can get out there and do my job. That’s the things I put my body through And I’m not ashamed of that because I get paid a lotta money to go out and perform. And I appreciate that they put that kind of trust in me.
TRACK: THAT NIGHT, HE THREW A THREE HITTER AND WON THE GAME. WHAT WORRIES HIM TODAY, HE TOLD US, IS ALL THE VIOXX PILLS VARIOUS TRAINERS GAVE HIM. VIOXX, WAS A WIDLEY USED ANTI-IMFLAMMATORY AND PAIN KILLER, BEFORE IT WAS TAKEN OFF THE MARKET FOR CAUSING HEART ATTACKS AND STROKES.
CLEMENS I was eating Vioxx like it was Skittles. And now that, now these people who are supposedly regulating it, tell me it’s bad for my heart. I don’t know what the future holds because of the the medicine that I’ve eatin, but I trusted that it was not harmful. And I didn’t wanna put anything in my body that was harmful.
TRACK: STEROIDS ARE HARMFUL HE SAID, AND WOULD HAVE SHORTENED HIS CAREER.
CLEMENS Why would I want to get tight or lose my flexibility, put something harmful in my system that’s gonna cause me to break down when I’ve had a 24 year career?
WALLACE Look, because you’re at the end of your career, and because you you don’t want to give up the career and give up the fame and so forth. So if it’s necessary to stick something into you—
CLEMENS I didn’t play my career to get fame or go to the Hall of Fame or worry about all that. That’s nice. That, all that’s nice. Again, it’s not who I am. I’ve worked my tail off to get where I’m at. I’m not gonna put something in my body for a quick fix that’s gonna tear me down.
WALLACE What penalty should there be for someone who is taking these performance enhancing drugs?
CLEMENS I think it’s a self-inflicted penalty. They break down quick. It’s a quick fix. They’re in and out of the game.
WALLACE If you were to testify before the congress under oath would you tell them exactly what you told me today?
CLEMENS And even probably more about the Vioxx question.
NEW TRACK: CLEMENS MAY APPEAR AS REQUESTED AT A CONGRESSIONAL HEARING IN TEN DAYS, HIS CHALLENGE IS GETTING PEOPLE TO BELIEVE HIM.
CLEMENS I don’t know if I can defend myself, I think people—a lot of people have already made their decisions.
WALLACE Well, a lot of people have made—
CLEMENS And that’s our country, isn’t it? Guilty before innocent. That’s the way our country works now. And then everybody’s talking about sue, sue sue. Should I sue? Well, let me exhaust. Let me, let me just spend. How about, let’s keep spending. But I’m gonna explore what I can do and then I want to see if it’s gonna be worth it, worth all the headache.
TRACK: BRIAN MCNAMEE’S ATTORNEY SAID MCNAMEE WILL DECIDE AFTER WATCHING THIS INTERVIEW WHETHER HE’LL SUE CLEMENS–FOR DEFAMATION. MCNAMEE DECLINED TO TALK WITH US. THE PROBLEM BOTH HE AND CLEMENS HAVE IS PROVING THEY’RE TELLING THE TRUTH.
WALLACE How about a lie detector test?
CLEMENS Some say they’re good. Some say they’re not. Do whatever. I mean—
WALLACE So as far as you’re concerned you would conceivably?
CLEMENS Yeah. I don’t know if they’re good or bad.
WALLACE Were you to pass a lie detector test, would that help prove that you’re telling the truth and help restore?
CLEMENS Would it?
WALLACE I don’t know.
CLEMENS I don’t either.
TRACK: AND HE DOESN’T KNOW IF HE’LL EVER PITCH AGAIN.
CLEMENS But I understand that as a public person, you’re gonna take some shots. The higher you get up on the flagpole, the more your butt shows? And I understand all that. But I’m tired of answering to ‘em. That’s why I will not ever play again. I don’t want to answer to it. I want to slide off and be just a citizen.
WALLACE You’re retiring? Period.
CLEMENS Probably.
WALLACE Not for sure, but—
CLEMENS I would say, yeah. If I sit here and tell you right now, I would say yes.
WALLACE You’re not going to pitch again?
CLEMENS You’ll never see me pitch again.
TRACK: BUT HE HAS RETIRED THREE TIMES BEFORE AND HE TOLD US HE COULD UN-RETIRE AGAIN.
WALLACE After listening to you in this interview, do you think people are going believe you? Believe that you, Roger Clemens never took steroids?
CLEMENS I think the people that know me believe me and understand what I’m about. And I can’t—the, the people that are out there that have been saying the things that they’ve been sayin’, I don’t know if I’ll ever swing their opinion, These accusations are not gonna change me as a person. I’ll, I’ll do everything I can to prove ‘em wrong. And and I still don’t know if that’s good enough.
